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  #26  
Old October 3, 2012, 01:30 PM
BagherBacha BagherBacha is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
We have a good number of talented pacers, all raw talents though. But unfortunately we don't have system in place to fine tune them and take them to the next level. Neither we have a strong pace culture like Pak or WI for them to be developed naturally at the club level.

It was so important for us to continue with coaches like Ian Pont ... There was a clear sign of development in the pace department under him. If we can have a HP camp for the pacers even now, we can come up with 3/4 good pacers in 6 months time.
We should fire Lotus kamal not to retain Ian. May be that face book picture by Ian was the reason for BCB not to retain him. pathetic
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  #27  
Old October 3, 2012, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BANFAN
We have a good number of talented pacers, all raw talents though. But unfortunately we don't have system in place to fine tune them and take them to the next level. Neither we have a strong pace culture like Pak or WI for them to be developed naturally at the club level.

It was so important for us to continue with coaches like Ian Pont ... There was a clear sign of development in the pace department under him. If we can have a HP camp for the pacers even now, we can come up with 3/4 good pacers in 6 months time.
No coach can help if a pacer(in this case any player) doesn't train all yr long. As they say, practice is the key to success! AFAIK, during off season, most of the players outside nats team do no training whatsoever. That's not their fault..It's because BCB doesn't have any alternative plans for these players. Unless we change that, we will continue to struggle in every department, not only pace.

Financially players needs help too. Just look at Talha. Got injured @ age of 18, was one of the Most Promising FAST bowler in the country back in the day but where is he now? BCB didn't bother to pay for his surgery, forget about looking after him...
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  #28  
Old October 3, 2012, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BagherBacha
We should fire Lotus kamal not to retain Ian. May be that face book picture by Ian was the reason for BCB not to retain him. pathetic
Get your facts right. The BCB offered me an extension to my contract. You can read why I didn't accept it here: http://www.espncricinfo.com/banglade...ry/508726.html

Read that headline :-)
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  #29  
Old October 3, 2012, 03:06 PM
BagherBacha BagherBacha is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Pont
Get your facts right. The BCB offered me an extension to my contract. You can read why I didn't accept it here: http://www.espncricinfo.com/banglade...ry/508726.html

Read that headline.
Hi Ian,

I was mad at BCB not to give you offer the way you want. They should have retained you at any cost.
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  #30  
Old October 3, 2012, 05:39 PM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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definitely need something where the players are training all year round, clubs/franchises should setup mandatory pre-season programs but outside of these programs there needs to be other outlets and facilities for the players to train, of course the players have to want to train to or they just won't. but minimum there needs to be mandatory pre-season training.

as far as pacers specifically a pace academy would help, because if there was the pace academy on top of the normal academy and HP unit and on top of scheduled A team series and national team series then young up coming prospects as well as national team fringe players will have want they need to train properly and develop, course as already said the players need to want to do it.
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  #31  
Old October 4, 2012, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoodlum
Your bad again...He came through a Talent Hunt program (not pacer hunt) and was selected straight from the U-17.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BagherBacha
Mash along with Shafaq and Talha were noticed by Andy Roberts when Mash was only 17 years old, can’t remember if it was from pacer hunt or talent hunt. As advised by Andy, he was rushed into A team where he played practice match against national team and beat the hell out of national cricketers

After few months he was sent to India with BD A team to play against some local teams where he was taking 4/5 wickets in every single match. India national team was playing abroad at that time, their pace bowlers sucked big time. I remember reading an Indian newspaper praising Mash and they wished they had a Mash to play for India. I was over the moon after reading that.

After India series he was called into national team. He was over used, that’s why we are seeing all of these injuries. Poor mash.
RUBEL was the product of the first ever PACER HUNT in bangladesh.

mash was spotted in the talent hunt of Andy roberts. roberts metioned shafaq had the best know how and aggression of a perfect pace bowler but lacked the skills to apply it consistently.

i am sure before getting into BD-A team Mash played for a BD u-17 team in a regional tournament where the u-17 teams from IND, PAK and SL.

that BD-u-17 team had Ashraful, nafees iqbal, Mohammed Sharif, Talha jubair and the ind u-17 team consisted shikhar dhawan, robin uthappa, ambati rayudu, Suresh raina, VRV singh etc.
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  #32  
Old October 4, 2012, 12:21 AM
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al-Sagar al-Sagar is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
I thought he was in U-19 but I am not too sure then. I remember watching him play alongside Ashraful and Nafees Iqbal for the U-19 team. The commentators and media used to call him 'Koushik' back then.

And yes, you are right about his talent. Once in a decade type of player.
probably you remember the same tourney i mentioned in the previous post.

as i am trying to remember more i think pak had Reaz Afridi ..... SL had jehan Mubarak
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  #33  
Old October 15, 2012, 04:50 AM
jeesh jeesh is offline
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So who do you all think will be our standout pace bowlers this upcoming NCL. My money is on Abu Jayed.

Here are our top 5 leading wicket takers (Pace) in the last 5 editions. Note national team seamers hardly break into the list- Shafiul, Nazmul, Rubel, Shahadat. Even Abul Hasan has only 5 wickets in 4 FC matches. So what is really the basis of selection for the NT?

2011/12

Dolar Mahmud-40
Al-Amin Hossain- 39
Abu Jayed-35
Mukhtar Ali- 32
Kazi Kamrul Islam- 26

2010/11

Farhad Reza- 19
Mahbubul Alam- 19
Mohammad Sharif- 18
Kazi Kamrul Islam- 17
Shafaq Al Zabir- 13

2009/10

Mohammad Sharif- 41
Kazi Kamrul Islam- 30
Syed Rasel- 25
Dollar Mahmud- 25
Robiul Islam- 23

2008/09

Robiul Islam- 48
Ziaur Rahman- 38
Talha Jubair- 37
Tareq Aziz- 35
Dolar Mahmud- 30

2007/08

Tareq Aziz- 43
Mahbubul Alam-39
Mohammad Sharif- 38
Talha Jubair- 38
Sajidul Islam- 36

Source: Cricinfo
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  #34  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:08 AM
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Sohel Sohel is offline
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Zunaid, Robiul and myself had lunch with Richard McInnes last week. He seems impressed by Taskin. He hasn't had a look at Shubhashish yet, but I think he'll be impressed unless young and big Mr. Roy's formidable abilities have declined since Asian Games.
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  #35  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:26 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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kazi kamrul in the top 5 the last 3 editions? what more does he have to do to get a look in?
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  #36  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gowza
kazi kamrul in the top 5 the last 3 editions? what more does he have to do to get a look in?
yeah I would like to see this guy picked too... Can't do much worse than the current bunch anyways
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  #37  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:36 AM
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BengaliPagol BengaliPagol is offline
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i hope at least one batsmen averages 50+ in this addition of the NCL. Can someone get the highest averages in each addition of the NCL so we have an idea of which batsmen were actually performing?
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  #38  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:38 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jadukor
yeah I would like to see this guy picked too... Can't do much worse than the current bunch anyways
he's a lefty as well so would add some variation to the pace attack.
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  #39  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gowza
kazi kamrul in the top 5 the last 3 editions? what more does he have to do to get a look in?
yeah thats what i thought as well. Surely he is better than Shahadat and Abul or possibly even better than Shafiul.
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  #40  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:43 AM
mij mij is offline
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As usual our selector not selecting right.
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  #41  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:43 AM
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BengaliPagol BengaliPagol is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeesh
Even Abul Hasan has only 5 wickets in 4 FC matches. So what is really the basis of selection for the NT?
Bowl fast.
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  #42  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:46 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BengaliPagol
yeah thats what i thought as well. Surely he is better than Shahadat and Abul or possibly even better than Shafiul.
there are a bunch of pacers that could be given more chances ahead of shafiul and shahadat. kazi kamrul is one, al amin and abu jayed are others, also guys like robin, dolar and sajidul didn't get to many chances before being discarded. dolar didn't even do that badly in his 7 ODIs, sure his econ rate was high (over 7) but his strike rate was only 26 and his average was 32 which for a BD pacer isn't bad at all on the international scene. robin and sajidul didn't fair as well as dolar during their internatioanl outings but they still could be or at least could have been given more chances in hindsight when you consider how many shahadat and shafiul etc have got.
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  #43  
Old October 15, 2012, 05:56 AM
jeesh jeesh is offline
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Having done a bit more digging, doesnt seem like guys like Shafiul, Rubel, Nazmul, Shahadat play a lot of FC matches. Maybe because they are engaged with the NT. But how many series do we play a year for them to be engaged with NT duty? Or are we putting tours in the wrong time, when our players should actually be playing FC cricket. How can we expect our NT pacers to pick wickets in the international arena, when they dont even play FC. And if Rubel, Shahadat, Shafiul, Nazmul are our best pacers we would ideally want the batsmen to be facing such bowlers. So time to really think BCB. Consistent success in FC is imperative for national team selection. We shouldnt go by skill or perceived skill only.

Btw agree with Sohel. Taskin Ahmed is another to watch out this season. Hope 3-4 pace bowlers can hit the 40 wicket mark.
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  #44  
Old October 15, 2012, 06:05 AM
jeesh jeesh is offline
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Just building on Gowza's post. Dolar Mahmud has 142 FC wickets with average of 24. Kazi Kamrul Islam 120 FC wickets at an average of 26. Abu Jayed 49 wickets, average of 20. Mahbubul Alam 133 wickets, average of 25. Sajidul Islam 125 wickets, average of 28.

Versus

Shahadat Hossain 147 wickets, average of 40. Rubel Hossain 41 wickets, average 61. Shafiul Islam 42 wickets, average of 37. Nazmul Hossain 71 wickets, average of 29. Of course the NT bowlers statistics will be a little messed up because they got a hammering in test cricket. But clearly the wickets are not there.

So once again how can we expect inexperienced FC cricketers to be successful in international cricket?
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  #45  
Old October 15, 2012, 06:45 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeesh
Just building on Gowza's post. Dolar Mahmud has 142 FC wickets with average of 24. Kazi Kamrul Islam 120 FC wickets at an average of 26. Abu Jayed 49 wickets, average of 20. Mahbubul Alam 133 wickets, average of 25. Sajidul Islam 125 wickets, average of 28.

Versus

Shahadat Hossain 147 wickets, average of 40. Rubel Hossain 41 wickets, average 61. Shafiul Islam 42 wickets, average of 37. Nazmul Hossain 71 wickets, average of 29. Of course the NT bowlers statistics will be a little messed up because they got a hammering in test cricket. But clearly the wickets are not there.

So once again how can we expect inexperienced FC cricketers to be successful in international cricket?
it's a good point, test matches are few and far between and when the domestic FC matches are being played the national players are either play test matches or some other form of international cricket or they're resting. there needs to be more FC cricket in BD, that's why it's good to here they are working on a 2nd FC tournament, but unless the test match players get in some FC cricket between tests then it will always be tough for them to develop and succeed in that format.
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  #46  
Old October 15, 2012, 06:49 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeesh
Just building on Gowza's post. Dolar Mahmud has 142 FC wickets with average of 24. Kazi Kamrul Islam 120 FC wickets at an average of 26. Abu Jayed 49 wickets, average of 20. Mahbubul Alam 133 wickets, average of 25. Sajidul Islam 125 wickets, average of 28.

Versus

Shahadat Hossain 147 wickets, average of 40. Rubel Hossain 41 wickets, average 61. Shafiul Islam 42 wickets, average of 37. Nazmul Hossain 71 wickets, average of 29. Of course the NT bowlers statistics will be a little messed up because they got a hammering in test cricket. But clearly the wickets are not there.

So once again how can we expect inexperienced FC cricketers to be successful in international cricket?
and so far al amin has 39 wickets at an average of 16. subashis roy is another to look at, he has 42 wickets at an average of 24. i'll be interested to see how babu does in the up coming season, so far only averaging 35 with the ball in FC cricket but has a 24 average in List A's and averages 43 with the bat in FC cricket with a century and 2 half centuries already.
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  #47  
Old October 15, 2012, 08:39 AM
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It's a good point to bring up. If our national team bowlers have average FC records, then how do we expect them to do well in the international arena? That being said, we also have to bring this point up as well, how much can we take out of these domestic statistics? Because remember, the NCL is known as "picnic cricket" and while these players could have success in domestics, they might not be cut out for international cricket.

Take a look at Dollar for example, the guy has been consistently been taking wickets at the FC scene in BD, but what does he do once he goes to India in the A team tour? He ended up being nonexistent. Kazi Kamrul has also been nonexistent at the Academy level. So this might be the reason as to why our selectors are sticking with the guys we have. They're probably going in with the mindset of going in with the guys have with pure potential instead of domestic stars.
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  #48  
Old October 23, 2012, 11:21 AM
jeesh jeesh is offline
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As expected spinners rule round 1. Shahadat was probably one of the better pace bowlers. Good to see Taskin amongst wickets
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  #49  
Old October 23, 2012, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeesh
As expected spinners rule round 1. Shahadat was probably one of the better pace bowlers. Good to see Taskin amongst wickets
And that says the condition of our pace pipeline. Did Mash play in this round? Is he completely giving up on longer formats?
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  #50  
Old October 23, 2012, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mufi_02
And that says the condition of our pace pipeline. Did Mash play in this round? Is he completely giving up on longer formats?
I don't think he played and it's probably best if he gives up on longer formats altogether. Jibone aagey, kheladhula pore.
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