Can Ravindra Jadeja Take Away Shakibs Crown

[Jadukor]

As I have said before it is still too early to compare the two. Stats are always better early on... remember Mendis and how he started? Shakib is the main target of all opposition bowlers and has to fight against specific game plans set for him. Jadeja might have started on equal footing but lets see what happens once bowlers and batters study him and figure out his tricks.

Jadeja played only 5 tests matches so far. I would wait another year or two before comparing.

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by Jadukor
As I have said before it is still too early to compare the two. Stats are always better early on... remember Mendis and how he started? Shakib is the main target of all opposition bowlers and has to fight against specific game plans set for him. Jadeja might have started on equal footing but lets see what happens once bowlers and batters study him and figure out his tricks.

Jadeja played only 5 tests matches so far. I would wait another year or two before comparing.

Yeah to way to early to compare in tests, they can be better compared in ODIs at this point.

[jeesh]

Originally Posted by Gowza
comparing stats what you see is that they've achieved similar outcomes regardless of the different situations they both bowl under. as far as batting goes though shakib has done better, over a greater period of time, over a greater number of innings. but it's pretty clear shakib has a greater batting responsibility than jadeja. shakib has batted 124 innings out of his 129 matches, jadeja has only batted 54 innings out of his 80 matches. shakib has 19 not outs in 124 innings, jadeja has 16 out of 54 innings. shakib has 5 centuries and 25 half centuries, jadeja has no centuries and only 6 half centuries (even with the difference in innings batted this doesn't match up).

so by looking at stats you get the feeling they're similar as bowlers, but shakib is the better batsman. however i do agree that shakib bowls and bats under more difficult circumstances more often than jadeja does. plus they have different batting roles in that shakib generally bats between 3-5 and jadeja probably bats around #6/7 most of the time. shakib has a slightly higher wickets per match ratio but that could be because he's relied upon much more for wickets than jadeja is, but it's not that big of a difference anyway (jadeja about 1.18 whereas shakib is about 1.29).

If you judge from first class, Jadeja is way ahead in terms of batting. Matter of time before he delivers in international cricket.

Anyway enough of comparisons with Shakib. Comparing with all other all rounders in world cricket atm, this guy looks extremely good. I cant think of any other all rounder among upcoming emerging players who is so equally capable with both bat and ball.

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by jeesh
If you judge from first class, Jadeja is way ahead in terms of batting. Matter of time before he delivers in international cricket.

Anyway enough of comparisons with Shakib. Comparing with all other all rounders in world cricket atm, this guy looks extremely good. I cant think of any other all rounder among upcoming emerging players who is so equally capable with both bat and ball.

but we aren't comparing at test level (so FC stats aren't as relevant), we've said it's to early, in list A's shakib is ahead, jadeja doesn't even have a list A ton, shakib has 5 and they all came in internationals not domestics. shakib often performs much better at international level than domestic level which also makes it difficult to compare domestic records.

of course jadeja's FC average is way ahead of shakib's, and maybe it is a matter of time, but maybe not. as i've shown, shakib has been better in the shorter formats at all levels with the bat in terms of numbers so he could therefore be better in tests to, or maybe not we'll have to wait and see. like i also said, shakib generally bats 1 or 2 places higher than jadeja does so that means shakib has more opportunity to make runs.

point is it isn't conclusive, it can go either way at this point, only time will tell.

[Night_wolf]

Originally Posted by jeesh
If you judge from first class, Jadeja is way ahead in terms of batting. Matter of time before he delivers in international cricket.

Anyway enough of comparisons with Shakib. Comparing with all other all rounders in world cricket atm, this guy looks extremely good. I cant think of any other all rounder among upcoming emerging players who is so equally capable with both bat and ball.

again that you cant say for sure, indian batting tracks are run feast, Rohit avgs 60 in FC, yet he cant get into the indian test team, same goes for monoj tewary

[NoName]

Shakib is way ahead of Jadeja in terms of batting, but in bowling its debatable who is better.

[Gowza]

Originally Posted by Night_wolf
again that you cant say for sure, indian batting tracks are run feast, Rohit avgs 60 in FC, yet he cant get into the indian test team, same goes for monoj tewary

india have a lot of batsmen averaging over 50 though so rohit would necessarily be next in line as he's failed in ODIs so they might just think he should be behind in the pecking order due to that. rahane also averages 60 in FC cricket, pandey, reddy, as you said manoj tiwary and i'm sure others who also average over 50. i made a thread about it awhile ago, there are quite a few. someone like chand has probably jumped up the pecking order purely by playing a good u19 knock on australian pitches and done decently in FC at home.

but certainly agree we can't say for sure as indian batting tracks are generally roads, plus the pace bowling isn't that great...(though getting better).

[jeesh]

Wickets in India are a lot more sporting than they used to be. Thats one of the reasons behind their rise. Quality of bowling is also very good-be it pace or spin. India has enough spinners to feed several test playing nations. The number and quality of pacers have improved significantly. They have 2-3 quicks who can bowl in their mid 140's. Mind you even Pakistan seems to be short of such bowlers these days.

[jeesh]

Like in economics every cricketing nation has a comparative advantage in producing certain types of players. Some point to upbringing, some point to role models/icons, some point to quality of coaching, age group exposure etc etc. India has this knack of producing 50+ Average batsmen. Its too harsh if we say its just because of the quality of the wickets. In terms of technique, ability to occupy the crease, concentration, footwork-they are probably the best. You put a Bangladeshi batsman in India, doesnt mean he will end up with an average of 40+. Its all about technical ability and mindset.

[sum_1]

Please read my post #45 and #47 for reference.

To add a few points to that.

Playing more doesn't mean you automatically gain points. You actually lose points for not performing, specially for an all rounder who has to perform with both bat and ball. If someone gets 5 wickets in an innings but scores a duck, he'll gain points as a bowler but lose the same as an all rounder. That's exactly what happened to Jadeja at the triangular series in WI. So playing more is not the key, it is the performance.

If FC records are an indication, then Jadeja has a good probability of becoming a better test player. And the FC records are a very good indication, for in spite of the flat tracks and ordinary bowling, Jadeja has achieved those records in a domestic circuit which is in all probability and with no disrespect more competitive than what Shakib plays in.

I may be wrong, but does these rankings take fielding into account? How many runs do they both save when fielding? How many 'smart' run outs do they make happen? How many good to outstanding catches do they take? It'd make for an interesting comparison.

To conclude, I'd go with the majority consensus of Shakib being the better batsman in ODIs with Jadeja being a slightly better bowler. However, it'd interesting to find out how it turns out in Tests, as it'd be more of a level playing field since there's is more or less the same opportunity while batting at no. 4 or 7 unless you're pushing for declaration. So I guess we'll have to wait and see.

[Gowza]

really it's a waiting game, shakib currently has quite a few international tons and half tons, jadeja doesn't have that many of course jadeja bats lower and hasn't played as much so as said it's a waiting game. the other thing is BD need shakib as a batsman and bowler, india don't really need jadeja much for either, they kind of need him as a bits and pieces player in that he's going to bat lowere order most of the time and bowling he's got guys like b.kumar, yadav, ashwin etc who are also good bowlers and therefore jadeja isn't needed as much. makes it tough to compare these two.

[jatindra]

it is too early to compare. Both are good player.

[Jadukor]

getting a good look at Jadeja on this overseas tour

[brockley]

A FTB bully in India.India played mist their cricket in india last 18 months.

[NoName]

Jadeja was never a match for comparison in the batting department, he is nothing compared to Shakib. But he is in competition for his bowling, interested to see how he fares in the tests, no rank turners this time, as Shakib got around 12+ wickets against SA in two tests there.

I did hear he is an excellent fielder, any opinions if he is better than Shakib in fielding?

[Night_wolf]

Originally Posted by NoName
Jadeja was never a match for comparison in the batting department, he is nothing compared to Shakib. But he is in competition for his bowling, interested to see how he fares in the tests, no rank turners this time, as Shakib got around 12+ wickets against SA in two tests there.

I did hear he is an excellent fielder, any opinions if he is better than Shakib in fielding?

shakib at the start of his career was a fantastic fielder, at par with jadeja..but ATM jadeja is better

[Jadukor]

Shakib never drops catches or misfields especially under pressure
I think Shakib is a very safe fielder

[godzilla]

An unfair comparison. Team India doesn't rely on Jadeja (Kholi is their main man) where as team Bangladesh loves to feed off Shakib's performance, be it with the bat or ball.

When Jadeja came into scene, he was a total piece of crap. Couldn't bat or ball, fielding was his thing. These days is a different story all together. I guess he is working hard behind the scene to improve massively from where he was a couple of years back.

The reason Shakib stands out most of the time is because our modons can't take a wicket or 2. Can't score a 50, let alone a 100. Usually Shakib is the one breaking the partnerships or scoring the runs which is why he stands out. Team India dosen't need Jadeja to score those 100's, they got Kholi, Dhoni, etc for that. They look at ashwin as their main spinner aswell. So even if he scores runs or gets wickets, it goes unnoticed most of the time. We unfortunately give all the burden to shakib and since he is a good player, he gets the job done.

Jadeja is not up there yet but he sure is closing the gap (in odi atleast, did not follow him in test cricket).

[horizon]

Originally Posted by Jadukor
Shakib never drops catches or misfields especially under pressure
I think Shakib is a very safe fielder

Do you still think so?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hp3jMbZ4vhM

[Navo]

^ Horizon, Dropped catches happen - I've even seen Dilshan, ABD drop catches. Doesn't make him bad overall.

Oh, and what about the run out today? Isam even mentioned it as one of the plays of the day!

[horizon]

That's exactly what my opinion is ... some lapse in fielding is acceptable. Who can forget Gibbs dropping Steve Waugh?

[Hasan2k8]

Big phaaaat NO!

But Jadeja can be alright at LOI's

[horizon]

Originally Posted by Navo
Oh, and what about the run out today? Isam even mentioned it as one of the plays of the day!

Some of Jadeja's run-outs -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXioXky_T4k
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TYg1LV_lJ4