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  #1  
Old July 28, 2019, 01:06 PM
anonymousGuy anonymousGuy is offline
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Default What Went Wrong Since The Pakistan Game

Bangladesh was doing quite well until that Pakistan game in the World Cup. So, what went wrong?

Since that game, we have fired most of our coaching staffs and there is a sense of panic among fans, players, selectors etc. I think this is where the problem is. Players lost confidence, fans lost trust, BCB is being irrational (firing too many people and whatnot) etc.

We need to realize that apart from that Pakistan game, we did reasonably well and we shouldn't panic too much. We may have to replace a few players but there's no need for wholesale changes.
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  #2  
Old July 28, 2019, 04:15 PM
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Eshen Eshen is offline
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A whole lot of things went wrong even before the Pakistan match actually:

1) Mash picked up hamstring injury during WC. He refused even to scan his injury, and stayed as a passenger in the team for the rest of the tournament.

2) They had a week long layoff before India-Pakistan matches. Instead of using the time for injury rehab, Mash and Co went for 5 day vacation.

3) Injury situation got so bad Mash and Mushfiq were not even practicing in nets before Pakistan match, and were not suppose to play in that match. They played disregarding the team plan made the night before.

4) Mash-Shakib got into conflict over Riyad's selection, after how Riyad derailed the chase against England. Afterwards, Shakib stopped attending team planning meetings.

5) Since Mash is untouchable now, BCB decided to make a scapegoat out of Rhodes - blamed him for not having control over the situations (Walsh and Joshi supposed to leave after WC anyway).

6) To make matters worse, Tamim apparently is having a bout of PTSD, because the abuse he faced from fans after his WC'15 failures.

Good news - we don't have another ODI series scheduled till December 2020. Shakib will get a chance to start fresh with T20I team in September at home, against Afghanistan, where there will be no Mash, and, most likely, no Riyad (he will have to go through a surgery and a long rehab afterwards).
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  #3  
Old July 28, 2019, 04:20 PM
rarbine2 rarbine2 is offline
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Riad will have a surgery? Clearly he is the 2nd best t20 player after Shakib so losing him will be a big blow.
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  #4  
Old July 28, 2019, 04:34 PM
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Eshen Eshen is offline
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If we are to learn anything from the WC, it should be that an injured player should not be allowed to derail the team, however good he might have been in past.
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  #5  
Old July 28, 2019, 05:06 PM
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I have to, agree issues were there way before the Pak match, its just that Shakib's ATG-like form masked those problems and we were on cloud nine.

India/Pak match exposed us badly.
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  #6  
Old July 28, 2019, 07:20 PM
anonymousGuy anonymousGuy is offline
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I am not saying that there were no issues. But, panicking and firing most of the people is not the way to go. Zimbabwe also fired a lot of the staffs after that UAE defeat and it made things much worse for them.

It is funny that they are firing coaches but not a single player has been dropped. No coach can help us if our players don't apply themselves.
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  #7  
Old July 28, 2019, 08:01 PM
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Fazal Fazal is offline
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The diff
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  #8  
Old July 28, 2019, 08:08 PM
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Fazal Fazal is offline
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The difference is Shakib...we are missing his #3 batting and his 10 over quality bowling + plus Saifuddin. That was musking all other weakness.

Now Mithun is forced to bat #3, Riyad lack of form is further exposed, Rubel and Shaf is forced to make up the overs, part timer Modaddek is also forced to bowl his full quota..

There was an opportunity to bring some new blood to try out... thanks to BCB (sarcastic thanks) we missed that opportunity in this series.
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  #9  
Old July 28, 2019, 08:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eshen
A whole lot of things went wrong even before the Pakistan match actually:

1) Mash picked up hamstring injury during WC. He refused even to scan his injury, and stayed as a passenger in the team for the rest of the tournament.

2) They had a week long layoff before India-Pakistan matches. Instead of using the time for injury rehab, Mash and Co went for 5 day vacation.

3) Injury situation got so bad Mash and Mushfiq were not even practicing in nets before Pakistan match, and were not suppose to play in that match. They played disregarding the team plan made the night before.

4) Mash-Shakib got into conflict over Riyad's selection, after how Riyad derailed the chase against England. Afterwards, Shakib stopped attending team planning meetings.

5) Since Mash is untouchable now, BCB decided to make a scapegoat out of Rhodes - blamed him for not having control over the situations (Walsh and Joshi supposed to leave after WC anyway).

6) To make matters worse, Tamim apparently is having a bout of PTSD, because the abuse he faced from fans after his WC'15 failures.

Good news - we don't have another ODI series scheduled till December 2020. Shakib will get a chance to start fresh with T20I team in September at home, against Afghanistan, where there will be no Mash, and, most likely, no Riyad (he will have to go through a surgery and a long rehab afterwards).
With all that chaos I am surprised we even won some gaMs. And we were picking mash as a captain only but look at this captain .. Has no control whatsoever. Shame!!!!!
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  #10  
Old July 28, 2019, 08:17 PM
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Too many matbors in one team. You can't have too many matbors like that. The team is dangerous when they play as a unit.

World beaters to bunch of dysfunctional sissies in a matter of couple of months.

Now I know why they wanna bring hathuri. Papon thinks hHathuri had control over the team. This is the same pos coach that bad mouth his employer after leaving. And he is the front runner. LOL.
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  #11  
Old July 29, 2019, 05:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anonymousGuy
Bangladesh was doing quite well until that Pakistan game in the World Cup. So, what went wrong?

Since that game, we have fired most of our coaching staffs and there is a sense of panic among fans, players, selectors etc. I think this is where the problem is. Players lost confidence, fans lost trust, BCB is being irrational (firing too many people and whatnot) etc.

We need to realize that apart from that Pakistan game, we did reasonably well and we shouldn't panic too much. We may have to replace a few players but there's no need for wholesale changes.
I agree. I believe most players other than those who might be really old by 2023 must be retained and given more chances to play together. Then there is a chance of producing a champion team for the next WC. Bangladesh throughout its cricket history has been hasty, I have noticed that from the time the board sacked Gordon Greenidge for saying BD was not yet ready to play test cricket after the ICC trophy win in 1997.
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  #12  
Old July 29, 2019, 07:42 AM
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You asked what went wrong? These same problems where there. Aside from Mushfiqur (still doing the job with the bat post WC) and Shakib's brilliance, who else really stepped up for BD on a regular basis? Shakib not playing this series amplified those issues farther. Out team is sucky sucky. Without Shakib, even more sucky sucky
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  #13  
Old July 29, 2019, 11:19 AM
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Rinathq Rinathq is offline
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teams going through a bad patch thats all. We were looking pretty decent until the WC. Even during the WC, the games we won, we dominated. But currently, with coaching staff issues, injuries, uncertainty about next leadership, out of form core.... its all a mess. May take some time but we will get back together. Best thing for BD right now is possibly a change in format and reset that ODI button.
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  #14  
Old July 29, 2019, 01:35 PM
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We were never really that good to begin with. Even with our legendary players we are ranked 7th in ODIs with ZERO trophies, we are also ranked below freaking AFG in T20.

I honestly don't see any future in Bangladesh Cricket to be honest. If I was some rich guy, I would start to market around field hockey for both men and women team. Belgium, Argentina, Spain, Germanay, etc all play field hockey just like football.
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  #15  
Old July 29, 2019, 02:43 PM
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Out players are anything but legendary..they are not even great..only shakib is great and some are above avg..rest are very below avg
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  #16  
Old July 29, 2019, 05:36 PM
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I'm sorry to say but the team is not good.

Tamim and Sarker are the best we have at top. Ideally, Liton bat with Tamim, but Sarker is a very good fielder and can bowl some handy medium pace. Yes, his batting is a worry, but overall, he's far better than anyone else. I stick to him. Better all-round package. One of these days, his batting will click, and we'll win that game. Tamim is out of form, but we know he has the ability and his experience is vital at the top. We don't have anyone else to replace him at the top I'm afraid. Liton as back-up or batting at five for now is fine.

Shakib and Mushfiqur at three and four is a no brainer. They have done exceptionally well at the world cup. It's when they get injured, the players we replace them with in those positions is what worries me. If they miss out on games, we should replace them with players that can actually bat in those positions. I don't mind Mehedi and Mosaddek batting there instead since they are proper batsman.

Mahmudullah is the problem. I'm sorry but his time is up. Need to move on. Mehedi should be our new batsman at five or even Mosaddek. Personally, I prefer Mosaddek at bench for now. Number six is without doubt Shabbir. He's also a very good fielder. Seven is Saifuddin. And the last four positions should be specialist bowlers. If they can bat, that's a bonus.

Like I said, it's when our best players get injured, the players we replace them with can be scary. Also, players batting in their unusual positions can also be a factor.

We need to bring in a couple of new, good younger players if we have any and replace them with Mithun, Riyad etc.

Tamim, Shakib and Rahim will lead them into their last world cups.
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  #17  
Old July 29, 2019, 07:25 PM
anonymousGuy anonymousGuy is offline
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This period of Bangladesh cricket reminds me of how they played in 2014. Bangladesh team lost to Afghanistan at home during 2014 Asia Cup. That loss psychologically destroyed them and they played like associates after that. It took a home series against Zimbabwe to get back confidence again (BD whitewashed Zimbabwe in Test and ODI).

I think BD should invite Zimbabwe or Afghanistan for a home series. If they can thrash the opponent at home, they can get confidence back. These away tours are not good for confidence currently. We are still a great team when we play at home.
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  #18  
Old July 29, 2019, 07:32 PM
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Unfortunately Zim got banned

As for Afg, on current form, they can pull off a win in our conditions
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  #19  
Old July 29, 2019, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RealSports
I'm sorry to say but the team is not good.

Tamim and Sarker are the best we have at top. Ideally, Liton bat with Tamim, but Sarker is a very good fielder and can bowl some handy medium pace. Yes, his batting is a worry, but overall, he's far better than anyone else. I stick to him. Better all-round package. One of these days, his batting will click, and we'll win that game. Tamim is out of form, but we know he has the ability and his experience is vital at the top. We don't have anyone else to replace him at the top I'm afraid. Liton as back-up or batting at five for now is fine.

Shakib and Mushfiqur at three and four is a no brainer. They have done exceptionally well at the world cup. It's when they get injured, the players we replace them with in those positions is what worries me. If they miss out on games, we should replace them with players that can actually bat in those positions. I don't mind Mehedi and Mosaddek batting there instead since they are proper batsman.

Mahmudullah is the problem. I'm sorry but his time is up. Need to move on. Mehedi should be our new batsman at five or even Mosaddek. Personally, I prefer Mosaddek at bench for now. Number six is without doubt Shabbir. He's also a very good fielder. Seven is Saifuddin. And the last four positions should be specialist bowlers. If they can bat, that's a bonus.

Like I said, it's when our best players get injured, the players we replace them with can be scary. Also, players batting in their unusual positions can also be a factor.

We need to bring in a couple of new, good younger players if we have any and replace them with Mithun, Riyad etc.

Tamim, Shakib and Rahim will lead them into their last world cups.
What has Mossadek achieved that you prefer him at 5? His bowling is beyond pathetic. Its funny and pathetic how management tried to use him as an allrounder.
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  #20  
Old July 29, 2019, 09:31 PM
rarbine2 rarbine2 is offline
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Then management should try Afif and Nasir in place of Mossadek and Mahmudullah since they are young and they are great fielders as well. Although, Nasir does not match practice selectors should try to reconsider his credentials as a player. Afif is a must since he played well against Afghanistan.
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  #21  
Old July 29, 2019, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rinathq
teams going through a bad patch thats all. We were looking pretty decent until the WC. Even during the WC, the games we won, we dominated. But currently, with coaching staff issues, injuries, uncertainty about next leadership, out of form core.... its all a mess. May take some time but we will get back together. Best thing for BD right now is possibly a change in format and reset that ODI button.
Sensible observation. I'm more concerned about the long term prospect beyond 2020. When it comes to player selection opinions seem to fall in one of two categories. Folks either want the seniors to carry on or they want to get rid of them altogether. I don't agree with either. It took 7+ years to make decent players out of Tamim/Mushy/Riyad. We can't just discard them now. We're hoping the new gen would have a higher ceiling and show more consistency. We see sparks of brilliance from players like Soumya, Sabbir, Miraz from time to time, but they seem to lack the mental makeup required to survive the pressure packed social media age. This is hindering their progress and could result in some individuals falling way short of their potential ceiling. So I'm not convinced we can take for granted the new gen will be better than the current gen.

Keeping an eye on the future here's how I think the selection process should work. Senior players should be guaranteed a spot in the team only for 2-3 series. If they get injured or lose form they should be replaced immediately and the new guy should get 2-3 series'. We know someone like Tamim or Riyad can make it back if they work hard enough. But right now they're not required to push themselves, their spots seem to be guaranteed even if they're injured or out of form. Depending on how things go the seniors probably have 2-3 good yrs left. In 2023 WC will we have a team that's even as good as this one?
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  #22  
Old July 29, 2019, 11:12 PM
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None of the young players are performing consistently and that remains a big issue , if we can't find some good talent who can perform consistently in next few years then we will be in big trouble.

Hiring some coaches for national team is not going to solve these problems BCB needs to realize that soon. But they are too concerned with all the trivial things.

Sri Lanka series was an opportunity to try out one or two new players and let them have a chance at international cricket but even with all the injuries we see no new players, just the tried and tested failures again.

The management needs to get it's vision and priorities straight. We cannot be happy with 8th or even 5th, the ultimate goal has to be to create a World Championship winning team and for that we need to create the best players in the world.
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  #23  
Old July 30, 2019, 12:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zman
Sensible observation. I'm more concerned about the long term prospect beyond 2020. When it comes to player selection opinions seem to fall in one of two categories. Folks either want the seniors to carry on or they want to get rid of them altogether. I don't agree with either. It took 7+ years to make decent players out of Tamim/Mushy/Riyad. We can't just discard them now. We're hoping the new gen would have a higher ceiling and show more consistency. We see sparks of brilliance from players like Soumya, Sabbir, Miraz from time to time, but they seem to lack the mental makeup required to survive the pressure packed social media age. This is hindering their progress and could result in some individuals falling way short of their potential ceiling. So I'm not convinced we can take for granted the new gen will be better than the current gen.

Keeping an eye on the future here's how I think the selection process should work. Senior players should be guaranteed a spot in the team only for 2-3 series. If they get injured or lose form they should be replaced immediately and the new guy should get 2-3 series'. We know someone like Tamim or Riyad can make it back if they work hard enough. But right now they're not required to push themselves, their spots seem to be guaranteed even if they're injured or out of form. Depending on how things go the seniors probably have 2-3 good yrs left. In 2023 WC will we have a team that's even as good as this one?
Agreed. Going through a radical change wont work. Our bench strength is absolutely horrific right now. For the sake of our prospective players, we need to persist with the seniors and allow these young guys like Saif, Afif, Yasir, Shoriful, Nayeem, Naim get more experience in domestics and A tours. But for starters, BCB needs to come up with a solid long term strategy. I am also worried about our team beyond 2020 as BCB only seems to be planning for the next T20 world cup at the moment.
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  #24  
Old July 30, 2019, 01:07 AM
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At least Mushfiqur averaging 165.00 though....
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  #25  
Old July 30, 2019, 06:37 AM
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All these useless senior players need to be kicked out. This lot is nothing but embarrassment. What kind of a senior player are you if you can only score 10 at Intl level ? Amarey diley amio andha-gundha 10 run kortey parbo.

Get in some new players asap and persist with them for a year.
The time for these senior players is up. This is the end of the line.

If you keep giving bs excuses that we have no one to replace these senior flopstars, our cricket will go nowhere and you will keep seeing these minnow performances from us.
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