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  #1  
Old October 8, 2013, 12:04 AM
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Tiger Manc Tiger Manc is offline
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Default Spin Attack: Bangladesh v New Zealand; have Bangladesh missed a trick?

With persistent rumours that Bangladesh will start the 1st Test with 8 batsmen and only 2 front line spinners, why won’t Bangladesh use 3 front line spinners and if so, why take Abdur Razzak ahead of Enamul Haque?

Not only is Enamul Haque a much bigger turner of the ball than Razzak, the stats show that Enamul Haque should’ve been persisted with and not hastily dropped after the Zimbabwe series. He deserved a run in the team, especially after topping the NCL charts 2 years in a row. He’s taken more First Class and Test wickets than Razzak as well as 5 wicket hauls and has a much better average than Razzak too.

I also wanted to point out that Bangladesh’s overall spin attack is far superior than New Zealand’s and surely both Test matches should be spin friendly. With Vettori out of the series, we won’t have a better opportunity to out spin the opposition. Anything other than a spin friendly pitch would be suicidal. Even if all 3 of Martin, Sodhi and Williamson were to play, they would have a combined Test wicket total of 30. Riyad on his own has 28. Enamul Haque has more career 5 wicket hauls than all 3 put together. Ish Sodhi has a First Class average of 52! So it would be a kick in the teeth for us not to take advantage of that! I just feel Bangladesh have missed a trick by not picking Enamul and picking Razzak instead. Don’t get me wrong Razzak has done well in limited overs, but Tests aren’t his speciality. He just doesn’t pose enough trouble for the batsmen and hence his average of 65 in Tests. Even if Razzak isn’t selected, why only pick 2 specialist spinners?


Enamul Haque jnr
First Class Wickets: 355
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 27
First Class Average: 28.70
Test Wickets: 44
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 3
Test Average: 40.61


Abdur Razzak
First Class Wickets: 251
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 11
First Class Average: 27.78
Test Wickets: 18
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 0
Test Average: 65.83


Sohag Gazi
First Class Wickets: 137
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 11
First Class Average: 26.54
Test Wickets: 26
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 1
Test Average: 37.23


Shakib al Hasan
First Class Wickets: 205
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 14
First Class Average: 30.25
Test Wickets: 106
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 9
Test Average: 32.79


Bruce Martin
First Class Wickets: 330
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 18
First Class Average: 36.14
Test Wickets: 10
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 0
Test Average: 47.10



Ish Sodhi
First Class Wickets: 27
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 1
First Class Average: 52.14
Test Wickets: 0
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 0
Test Average: N/A


Kane Williamson
First Class Wickets: 69
Career 5 Wicket Hauls: 1
First Class Average: 41.46
Test Wickets: 20
Test 5 Wicket Hauls: 0
Test Average: 32.95
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  #2  
Old October 8, 2013, 12:29 AM
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BD_TigerZ BD_TigerZ is offline
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This should have been the attack
Enam Jnr
Gazi
Shakib

This is what thwy pick

Gazi
Shakib
Riyad/Naeem/Nasir

Poor selwction and If shakibs out that makes matter worse.
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  #3  
Old October 8, 2013, 12:46 AM
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ReZ_1 ReZ_1 is offline
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need to see how well shakib is in form with the ball... otherwise we need extra support from the raz or enamul..
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  #4  
Old October 8, 2013, 02:42 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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to be fair on razzak he was brutal in the last FC season, and he actually has a better FC average than enamul, his career best FC bowling is also better (a 9fer as opposed to enamul's 7fer). enamul has done better with his test chances, better average, better strike rate (though still poor at 80), more wickets (but then he's also played 6 more tests than razzak has), he has more 5fers and even a 10fer in tests so those are the positives for enamul.

but then you could make case for a myriad of domestic spinners. shuvo in FC still averages 22, strike rate of 50 and in his 1 test got 4 wickets, average of 36 and strike rate of 74. but no one wants him selected after seeing him bowl.

saqlain sajib is averaging 20.96, strike rate of 43 from 47 FC matches, he's got more FC 4fers and 5fers than razzak already yet he's played 16 less matches than razzak and he''s only 34 wickets short of what razzak has as well (actually the somparison with shuvo is similar).

enamul despite still being a domestic giant hasn't quite looked the same i believe, gets less turn i heard nowadays than he use to.

btw saqlain's numbers are quite incredible, in his 7 domestic FC seasons he's never averaged above 25. 24.48 was his worst season, that was last season, the season before that it was 21.90, before that 17.44, then his other 3 seasons (his first 3) he averaged in the 19s in all of them.

anyway probably enamul should have been selected because he was in the zim series and did alright, though it was awhile ago. they obviously picked enamul over razzak for that zim series so why swap it around now?
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  #5  
Old October 8, 2013, 02:53 AM
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^^ I agree. It was wrong to discard him after one series. He earned the right to be given a run.

You also forgot to mention Elias Sunny who I'd pick ahead of Razzak.
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  #6  
Old October 8, 2013, 06:05 AM
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By picking 2 or 3 pacers, who will give away 60-70 runs in 10-12 overs, we are practically gifting away the first test to NZ. We really needed 2 fulltime spinners excluding Shakib, who is burnt out, injured and out of form....

On 3rd day of the match, our selector Haba and happy go lucky coach will realize their mistakes...but it will be too late by then
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  #7  
Old October 8, 2013, 06:13 AM
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Enam is unlucky to miss out...with his turn and bounce he could be a lot deadly than any one of our pacers...if we ever win a test, it would be only for spinners, pacers can only play a side role...it's not their fault, we are just not that good in pace dept yet...at least not right now... Razzak could open as a spinner from one end..so can Gazi...and I can't believe Saqlain Mushtaq is not with the team..
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  #8  
Old October 8, 2013, 07:16 AM
MHRAM MHRAM is offline
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I am pretty sure we wont pick more than 2 Pacers. and those available are in form and not the usual piece of gong like shahadat improve ability whose selection was based on their x factor.chillax
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  #9  
Old October 8, 2013, 07:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reyme
Enam is unlucky to miss out...with his turn and bounce he could be a lot deadly than any one of our pacers...if we ever win a test, it would be only for spinners, pacers can only play a side role...it's not their fault, we are just not that good in pace dept yet...at least not right now... Razzak could open as a spinner from one end..so can Gazi...and I can't believe Saqlain Mushtaq is not with the team..
They decided to bring him in for the World T20 instead of the Test series! So you know which formats take priority for the BCB.
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  #10  
Old October 8, 2013, 08:48 AM
King13 King13 is offline
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Don't know why Razzak is included in Test Squad. Our bowling options should have been Shakib, Enamul, Gazi! Spin trio.
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  #11  
Old October 9, 2013, 07:41 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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shakib is still easily the best spinner, gazi gets the #2 pick because he's as good as any of the next best spinners except he's an offie bowler instead of an SLA. 3rd spinner spot then goes to one of possibly many choices e.g. razzak, enamul, sajib, sunny etc. is there really much difference between these guys?
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  #12  
Old October 9, 2013, 07:47 AM
Max100 Max100 is offline
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i would always pick enam jr, shakib and sohag as spin trio. razzaq should be in odi and T20 team. enam jr is must for our test team
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  #13  
Old October 9, 2013, 09:24 AM
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razzaq to aj valoi khello so it's working well
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  #14  
Old October 9, 2013, 09:25 AM
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Like I said in the match thread, Any SLA (Elias, Enam, Sajib, Sanjamul, Shuvo, Nabil) could pick up 2 or more wickets if they are given 32 overs to bowl on a single day against a spin scared side like New Zealand. He is our best bowler for the shorter format and it would have been wise to leave him at that. Both Elias and Enam would have been a better option given the fact that both are better turners of the ball.
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  #15  
Old October 9, 2013, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rinathq
Like I said in the match thread, Any SLA (Elias, Enam, Sajib, Sanjamul, Shuvo, Nabil) could pick up 2 or more wickets if they are given 32 overs to bowl on a single day against a spin scared side like New Zealand. He is our best bowler for the shorter format and it would have been wise to leave him at that. Both Elias and Enam would have been a better option given the fact that both are better turners of the ball.
I doubt that. All our SLAs looks basically the same. There was so much hype on Enamul and although he was decent in Zimbabwe, he wasn't anything special and was a typical SLA who seemed to bowling more like in an ODI than a Test match.

So might as well have Razzak in who is our most experienced international bowler for all forms for now.

Rather than just throwing in SLAs, we should be looking to develop Noor to vary our bowling attack. Having a good offie along with a good leggie will make our bowling a lot more attacking.
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  #16  
Old October 9, 2013, 10:22 AM
MHRAM MHRAM is offline
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Razzak is no wicket taker for tests. A test class bowler is someone that can deceive the batsman using flight, like shakib used to in the past.

Razzak's bowling is more suited to frustrate the batsman although the frequency of deliveries on the pads and longhops were an eye-sore. Lets hope he cleans up the tail
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  #17  
Old October 9, 2013, 01:22 PM
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I believe Razzak was okay since he can open bowling. It was Rubel who should have not been included. I think Al Amin, Zia type bowler who are more accurate could make better impact. Also I firmly believe Saqlain Sajib, Enam or Sunny would be more effective The second pacer...

We should have made a spin track and taken 3 fulltime test spinner and one pacer. 3rd spinner could have been Razzak instead of Second pacer....
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  #18  
Old October 9, 2013, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiger444
I doubt that. All our SLAs looks basically the same. There was so much hype on Enamul and although he was decent in Zimbabwe, he wasn't anything special and was a typical SLA who seemed to bowling more like in an ODI than a Test match.

So might as well have Razzak in who is our most experienced international bowler for all forms for now.

Rather than just throwing in SLAs, we should be looking to develop Noor to vary our bowling attack. Having a good offie along with a good leggie will make our bowling a lot more attacking.
totally agree. All our SLA'er r gd at throwing darts. no variation whatsoever


we need to fast track noor tho. look at Sodhi, havent done anything special in fc/A level, yet got called up because he IS A TALENTED LEGGIE...
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  #19  
Old October 9, 2013, 04:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nadim 98
totally agree. All our SLA'er r gd at throwing darts. no variation whatsoever


we need to fast track noor tho. look at Sodhi, havent done anything special in fc/A level, yet got called up because he IS A TALENTED LEGGIE...
Agreed. I don't get why they haven't. It should definitely be in their plans. Noor has a FC average of a 33 and List A average of a 26. Those are some good stats.

Also don't care much if he hasn't topped the wickets charts. Although Gazi was good in domestics, did he top the charts? And now look at how well he's done in Tests compared to the other SLA's.

We already have Shakib whose good enough, we have Noor and Gazi in, that'd be a very good spin lineup.
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  #20  
Old October 9, 2013, 04:28 PM
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Leg spin is a difficult art to master. It can be lethal once mastered, but if you're any less than a master, you're a nobody.
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  #21  
Old October 9, 2013, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AsifTheManRahman
Leg spin is a difficult art to master. It can be lethal once mastered, but if you're any less than a master, you're a nobody.
Might as well try though. Our SLAs don't seem to have much of a future in Tests. Razzaks fine for now in Tests but would like a more threatening spin lineup and Noor could give us that option.
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  #22  
Old October 10, 2013, 05:19 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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i reckon the one who gets the most turn with the most variations and obviously decent accuracy and domestic numbers backing him should be the one to go with. razzak just doesn't seem to have the strike capability in test matches and enamul seems to have lost it. perhaps continue with sunny for a bit? or is there someone else? nur i don't think is ready for tests, maybe ODIs...
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  #23  
Old October 20, 2013, 07:04 PM
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If I was the coach, I would have prepared 3 pitches and ask my top 9 spinners and have them bowl 30 overs each in each of those tracks. I would also play my top batsmen against spinners. I would then select the track and best 3 spinners for my starting 11 for Test 1. I would change spin combo for second Test so that opposing team don't get used to first 3 spinners.

1st Test : Razzak, Gazi, Saqlain Sajib

2nd Test: Enam Jr., Gazi, Sunny

Shakib is there anyways. My goal would be have NZ all out around 250 each inning and Win it within 4 days as my batsmen lack temperament for long inning in general..
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  #24  
Old October 21, 2013, 09:53 AM
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Razzak is no good in tests. If we wanted an SLA, Enam should have played. If we wanted variations, there are not that many options, but perhaps Noor could have played.
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  #25  
Old October 22, 2013, 04:00 AM
Gowza Gowza is offline
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yeah i think from this series we can establish we should move on from razzak as a test option. i think the next options are enam jr, elias sunny and saqlain sajib. noor i think is a possibility in the shorter formats, he actually has quite a good list A record.
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